Tax presets - tax due period

Hello. I have pension investments that return a certain amount of taxes, but at a much later date (typically 6 to 30 months later).

I have no problems setting up a negative tax rate in the tax presets, however i don’t know how to set the tax/refund due date differently.

For now, the refund is immediate, while for example my october 2023 investment will only get a refund, once, in February 2025.

How can i make this work?

Interesting case. If they’re returned, then are they already paid? Like being recorded in the Tax Paid field?

Because I suppose it shouldn’t be a negative rate, rather a proper positive rate that is… cancelled after 6-30 months. Capitally has a Tax to Pay column, which is Tax Due - Tax Paid. So if Tax Due is 0, you’re owed the paid tax.

There’s currently no way to alter the tax event’s date. You can only change which tax year the event is assigned to for reporting.

But I think it could be solved without it, at least for now.

Would it work, if you applied the tax rate (proper positive on) only until this 6-30 months has passed?

It would require me adding some date math functions to formulas, but it’s rather simple.

Sorry i wasn’t clear enough. A percentage of my investment in N is refunded in N+2. So at no point in time do i actually pay taxes, a percentage of my investment is just refunded. So let’s say if I invest 1.000€, my investment account is credited for this amount even tough it actually cost me only 700€.

I don’t know however if that changes the problem/solution :slight_smile:

Can you give me a link to an article that describes this tax scheme?

Here you go :slight_smile:

There is also (at least) another program more or less just like this one (other amounts, rebates…).

Ok, so if I understand it right, you basically get a tax break at the end of the year. So instead of a negative tax, you should be able to get the amount of contributions/costs within the year, and depending on the amount, reduce your tax obligation by a certain amount.

And as I understand correctly, it’s a tax on your regular tax, not capital gains tax…

To model it correctly, there should be a way to:

  • have a global event at the end of the year - currently not possible - global, so you can sum all the assets, and also regardless if position is still open or not
  • read the sum of expenses for the year - should be possible with global variables, but never tested this. It’s currently not possible to read the sum of expenses so far.
  • apply negative tax - already possible, could be extended to just apply the tax break, without affecting the revenues (currently you need to “fake” the revenues or expenses to do that)

I’m gathering different ideas to expand tax support, so just please confirm if my thinking is right

Yes technically correct. The rebate is on one’s global income tax.

That seems about right. Although I’m not sure what are revenues and expenses in your example. Also there are no investment taxes, only a general income tax rebate that applies only because of the investment. Which can be faked by applying a negative tax on the investments.

The rebate is a known quantity (a % of the total investments of each year). Another way to look at it is just a one-time income.

Perhaps a solution might be to be able to define a predetermined income path for investments, which can be customized according to a set of rules in the same way as tax presets.

  • For example in this case: if year = N+2, then income = 30% of year N investments, else income = 0.
  • For real estate: monthly rent x (1 + given annual increase)^n.
  • For savings accounts: if holding period is uninterrupted for 12 months, income = savings x (base rate + fidelity rate), else income = savings x base rate.

For me the idea was just to 1) automate this input in my portfolio, and 2) have a more precise view of my returns by correctly taking into account this tax rebate.

Got it. To automate this, taxes support would have to be expanded - I’ve added this to the backlog.

To account for the rebate, at any time you can add an Other transaction on your home currency in whichever account you want (or no account). And you set it’s value to 0 and Tax Paid to -1234 (if your rebate is 1234 that is ;)). This will be included in the returns.